Plater is the boy who cried wolf!!!! There has not been one instance of a snake being run over by a mower at Sharp Park. Plater has a picture of a dead snake, that he says was killed by a mower. The problem with this picture is the snake is in one piece!!! There is no proof that this snake was killed at Sharp Park let alone anywhere in Pacifica. Just because Plater said it happened does not make it true.

Plater and his crew keep moving the goal posts when they don't get what they want. Do not fall for this outsiders view of Pacifica and Sharp Park. Plater is just trying to make a name for himself and could care less about snakes or frogs. A "restored Sharp Park" will do nothig to help Pacifica's economy and will not woo hikers and bikers as he says. Take a look at Mori's Point. While we had our monthly golf tournament Saturday, with over 100 men & women golfing, I saw 3 hikers on Mori's point. How much money did these 3 hikers spend in Pacifica that day? My guess......ZERO!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sharp Park makes money pure and simple!!! Plater and his crew keep referring to a 4 year old report that says otherwise. If the course was a money loser for the city don't you think they would close it?

The Sharp Park Golf Course is good for golfers all, seniors, men, women & junior golfers. More importantly the course is good for Pacifica.

Butch, if that's your real name: get help. Your obsession with Brent is unhealthy and makes you seem like a thug. Talk about facts instead of personal attacks and you might seem credible someday.

Jon, if that's your real name, the facts are clear. I have no obesession with Brent Plater. I have an obsession with the truth and he does not tell the truth. Where are the so called personal attacks of which you speak?

Fact: Plater keeps referring to a 4 year old financial report.

Fact: Sharp Park makes money for he city of SF and Pacifica.

Fact: More people use Sharp Park Golf Course on any given weekend than use Mori's Point in a month.

The facts are clear Jon maybe you just can't see them through your rose colored glasses.

San Francisco's so called restoration plan is thinly veiled pork: the plan is to protect the golf course from a rising sea level, and relocate the endangered species off the property to nearby Mori Point.

The costs to maintain the golf course are at least $30 million to start. The real costs are even higher: armoring the beach at Sharp Park will cause loss of that beach - it will be just like Rockaway Beach in Pacifica: all rocks, no beach. This loss of walking area, food and shelter for wildlife, is unacceptable.

A better answer for Pacifica would be to transfer the property to the national park system -- which wants the property, but not the golf course. GGNRA is ready and able to change Sharp Park's 400 acres into a national park -- for everyone to enjoy -- and no more money losses for San Francisco. Money saved can be used for San Francisco's several other golf courses.

I'm not surprised at all by the attack on Mr. Plater by the very first commenter, it's part of the "denial of science" blasts going out to all the Pacifica related web sites orchestrated by a cabal of pro-development type. The only tool they have in their arsenal is personal attack in the hope to silence the voice of anyone who wants to make a cogent argument on either side of the issue, labeling them as "outsiders" or worse.

They dance on the edge of slander and libel and belittle anyone that doesn't agree with their viewpoint, you can be sure that Pacifica Patch is now squarely in their sites. Unfortunately the internet age has removed the editorial filter that used to keep extremism at bay, a price we pay for progress. Hopefully, anyone looking for the facts on Sharp Park can move beyond the sniping and find plenty of information at the Wild Equity Institute and other local legitimate environmental sites.

Bhatman, are you kidding? The science clearly states that frogs and snakes cannot live in saltwater. Have you read Karen Swaim's report? Do not blindly follow Plater's words and attacks.

FYI, the WEI site is full of misinformation and untruths. Just because you say it does not make it so. Turning Sharp Park into a frog and snake park will kill them!!!!! This is a science based fact that you and your crew cannot seem to get. Are you willing to sacrifice the frogs and snakes for another place to hike? That's how it seems from the cheap seats.

Stop spreading misinformation. You base your conclusions a biased non-scientific SFPR report with no historical evidence that Laguna Salada was some kind of a salt marsh environment, and thus, that the golf course and the berm are what brought frogs and snakes to the site.

The SFPR report should have served to dispel the golf facilitation mythology, and instead it perpetuated it by including no historical ecological informationwhatsoever. The coastal geomorphology of Laguna Salada is very similar to Lake Merced, Rodeo Lagoon, Abbot’s Lagoon and Pescadero Marsh. These systems are all coastal lagoon systems that experience some salt water influx as a result of winter storms, but which, otherwise are primarily influenced by the freshwater streams that feed them. What information exists to state otherwise vis-à-vis Sharp Park? None.

Now please come down from the "cheap seats" and do a little research, you can start by looking at the earliest pre-1900 US Geological Survey maps (T-sheets) that show Laguna Salada as a freshwater lagoon.

Bhatman, "scientific evidence" from the Center for Biological Diversity or Wild Equity is about as credible as scientific evidence about creationism and evolution coming from the Institute for Creation Research.

Your conspiracy theory is funny, though.

The CBD/WE mafia accuses others of "denial of science" and then immediately disregards the Swaim report. Please, could you share your scientific credentials so that we can compare them with Karen Swaim's?

Your request implies that you have the capability or credentials to make a comparative analysis. I see no evidence that that implication is valid.

Here we go with the non answers. Damn, I had 2:37pm in the pool.

It's a fair question Scotty asks.

Why not use your real name Bhatman?

Camden, Bhatman is calling people names and hurting our feelings. Remove Bhatman's comment and blacklist him/her/it.

If you don't do it now, it will be done with vicious delight when we Rovians accomplish our secret conspiracy (although, sadly, exposed by Bhatman) of taking over Patch!

You guys are a trip, you know that?

You should have the courage to use your real name. Stand behind of what you speak Bhatman.

And by the way, who's name calling now? "Cheap shot artists"?

Back to the facts. First of all Butch Larroche is a stand up man. Personal attacks against him are without just cause. He is providing facts and not based on the innuendos and conjecture.
In my most humble opinion, a national park would not create revenue as does the golf course but would actually cost millions to create and maintain. Much mure than a golf course that has been around for close to a century. The transformation based on studies performed many actually cause more harm to these endangered species by dredging and use of heavy equipment. Common sense would dictate that a large bulldoser has more of a chance of killing a snake, frog or other species than a greenskeeper mowing the lawn. The current proposal in modification of the course and creating protected habitat and the integrity of the course has merit. It should not be envirionmentalists against golfers. Its about finding a happy compromise. The old adage "keep it simple stupid" seems appropriate here.

Bathman,

Rodeo Lagoon and Abbot Lagoons are BRACKISH lagoons..do they support the CRLFs and the SFGSs?
Lake Merced is some distance from the coast and east of Skyline Blvd which is at least 500 feet high - salt water gets to Lake Merced thru ground water I presume?
Natural predators, hawks, birds, racoons, foxes...as well as feral cats and dogs do away with more CRLFs and SFGSs than any golfer or lawnmower ever will (which they don't)
This is not about endangered/threatened species - this is a land grab pure and simple

Bharfman, I've haven't seen such convoluted gibberish since the Hallman-esque comments I used to read on Pacifica-L.

The mud slinging and petty grenade lobbing in these forums detract from any scientific data driven debate I had hoped to find here. Why not instead, post links to the data sources you cite, write a clear and objective proposal for solutions that includes requisite funding or alternatives (ex. - solicit funds/donations to buy the quarry to build a course there in trade for the golf course?), and welcome an open and meaningful dialogue? I am not advocating this solutions specifically, but it is an example of compromise to all parties that is needed to come to a MUTUALLY acceptable solution. As citizens of Pacifica we should concern ourselves with a holistic approach at remedying the perceived problems that values our ecological assets as well as our recreational/business assets. We are smart people dedicated to our causes, so why all the fighting instead of developing solutions that can be tuned/tweaked to become mutually amenable? It sure would seem this is an example of a two party system, both side making childish attempts to "prove" their special interest agenda superior by shouting down the other side.
I find myself sadly disappointed and will look elsewhere for an open and inviting community, where I don't fear posting a comment that will simply be met with dispersions and disinformation (from BOTH sides). Good luck to all of you and I hope you find it in you to remain civil and help come up with the best possible solution for ALL interested parties.

Erik,

I've been inspired by the Daily Show with Jon Stewart and the Rally to Restore Sanity, so let me expound on one of his main points . . . that is, just because there are two sides in a debate does not mean there are 2 legitimate points of view. There are a myriad of faults with the NPS argument, which have been dismissed ad nuaseum by both science and political bodies. Yet no matter how many times a lie is refuted, Brent Plater and the CBD/WEI continue the assault. Quite frankly, they remind me of the birther movement in this country. No matter how many times they have been factually refuted, no matter how many legal challenges have been dismissed, no matter how often they find themselves plunging down rabbit holes from the weight of the inaccuracies of their own arguments . . . they persist that President Obama was not born in the United States. Whatever criticisms one may have of President Obama (and as a liberal Democrat I still feel there are many), it seems that birther argument should have run its course by now and it hasn't. Because there is one side of the discussion that "feels" they are right and will extrapolate any information to justify their point of view.

...

The "compromise" is keeping the 18-hole golf course and making some adjustments to better the habitat for 2 species. It has already been made. There is no further cause for discussion. One side has been repeatedly refuted time and time again. What you are experiencing is not mudslinging, it is frustration that no matter how many times they've been proven factually wrong or unable to substantiate their arguments, the CBD/WEI side of the debate continues undeterred in their holy quest for a land grab. And this has nothing to do with frogs or snakes with them; they have no healthy interest in either species. This is about power and control. Or rather their lack of it to get what they want.

Jeff, spot on comments by you as usual.

Please delete personal attacks --- it does nothing to help the quality of discussion. Quite the opposite.

"personal attacks" = those opinions with which you disagree

Thankfully by the time the final move is made I will be gone. I fear that absolutely nothing will ever happen to save Pacifica. The pseudo enviros will continue to drive business from Pacifica, the infrastructure will continue to crumble, taxes will continue to increase while services decrease, and eventually the mighty Pacific will reclaim what we cannot protect. Plater et al will move on to their next quest, happy "they" have allowed Mother Nature to triumph.